如何找到优秀的设计人才？她最有发言权
在招募设计团队方面，Wert & Co.有一套行之有效的方法论。自1995年成立以来，该公司为《财富》美国500强公司、全球各大品牌和新创企业招募了不少颇有分量的设计类关键带头人。朱迪·韦特是一名设计师，她和丈夫杰夫在儿子丹尼尔上幼儿园的第一天，在自家客厅创办了业务遍布东西海岸的猎头公司。作为协助大公司寻觅设计、技术和创新类人才不可或缺的可靠合作伙伴，随着客户群不断增长，公司声誉也越来越好。现在，她的儿子丹尼尔已经为公司迈入下一阶段做好了准备：凭借为早期创业公司做人力资源工作的背景，他加入公司并担任总经理一职；除了负责工程、设计和产品类职位的招聘工作，还雄心勃勃地参与到设计行业领导人才的发展中。在此，这对母子档谈到了公司早期的发展历程、设计业的前景以及C级高管到底需要什么样的特质。
《财富》：Wert & Co.是怎样创建的？
朱迪·韦特：当时数字领域才刚刚兴起，设计和科技行业都在寻找发展方向。我们先是租了一张办公桌，接着几个月后租了间办公室开始创业。再过了几个月，我们雇了员工，而客户也在持续增长。那是一个很好的时机，适合挖掘希望在设计和科技助力商业的新浪潮中乘风破浪的人才。我们的品牌理念是：“在这里，让跨领域学科找准定位，让设计助推商业成功。”这是我们在1995年做出的承诺，但行业发展到今天也依然适用。
随着时代变迁，设计行业发生了哪些转变？
丹尼尔·韦特：如果从我们公司的发展历程来看，设计业的变化轨迹与爆发新冠疫情以后会有所不同。以旁观者的视角看来，有两点让我颇为震惊。第一，设计受到了重视。在以前，设计被视为辅助的注脚或事后想法。当然，随着技术的崛起，越来越多的公司转型成了科技公司，所以设计的重要性也增加了。对Wert & Co.而言，最初很多客户都属于时尚、平面设计、工业设计和印刷等创意领域。而后，我们开始越来越多地接触软件开发公司。科技占据了我们很多的生活空间，而设计是生活的反映。这是一个很大的转变。如今在领导层、董事会和风险投资中，都能够看到设计的身影。在公司从无到有的阶段，设计变得越来越重要。
爆发疫情后，设计业有哪些变化？疫情有没有改变公司的招聘方式？
丹尼尔·韦特：人才库现在都是全球化的。如今，很多公司更愿意到非典型的地方招募人才，以建立更国际化的网络。如果你开的小公司位于小镇，而一群大公司喊着“我们要去那里搞招聘”，那么这间小公司就会面临前所未有的竞争。在这种情况下，难以从地理角度来推断员工的薪酬，通常大型公司将从中受益。疫情肯定催生了这种转变，但谁也无法预测5至10年后会是什么样......我认为，员工从来没有像今天这样拥有如此大的权力，这将迫使公司改变留住员工的方式，比如提供居家工作的选择和其他福利。在过去一年里，每个人的理想生活都面临危机，就业环境也变得更加复杂。几乎每家公司都把招聘计划搁置了很久，而现在，他们正试图把失去的时间补回来。
你提到各大公司正在追赶招聘进度，如何看待这种情况？
丹尼尔·韦特：我们都听过“雇用要慢，解雇要快”的谚语，也明白其含义是：双重考量，一次解决，如果公司发展不顺利，就需要迅速果断地做出决策。如果公司不够体贴，就会优化在职员工，而不一定要留人。因此，目前可能会出现减员和裁员潮。我希望不要发生这种情况，但如果发生了也不会感到惊讶。
朱迪·韦特：需要在招聘和规划时建立更多规则，以便留住人才和壮大公司文化。
过去一年里，您的公司完成了哪些重要的招聘工作？
朱迪·韦特：我们有幸参与的猎头工作体现了不同的范畴，并更加深刻地凸显出设计在当下的地位。疫情期间，我们为《纽约时报》（New York Times）寻觅到一位产品设计高级副总裁。这是一家受强烈使命感驱动的媒体，而好的新闻工作比以往任何时候都重要。在爆发疫情和种族正义运动期间，《纽约时报》需要寻找人才提升产品设计，这项工作很复杂，也令人兴奋，雇佣环节还涉及多方利益相关者。《纽约时报》在寻求转型，我们的文化和世界也在发生改变。另一大领域则围绕着数据和隐私；实时数据和人工智能正在成为常态。我们需要为一家金融机构的数据伦理和机器学习部门招募一位经验丰富的设计领导者，其工作需要以负责、安全的方式解锁数据。第三项任务则与旅游业有关。我们都知道，该行业受到了疫情的严重冲击。我们为四季酒店（Four Seasons）招募到一位高级设计副总裁。该公司正在思考奢侈品消费者的未来，特别打算在后疫情时代，利用设计思维优化四季酒店的体验和品牌接触点。
为什么招募设计类人才很重要？
朱迪·韦特：对企业而言，设计是一项极具战略性的工具。企业需要精通工艺、内容和技术，并且怀着无限勇气和信念带来改变的设计师。无论是社会创新还是其他新的赛道，现在都有很多创新的机会，而公司内部也正在组建新的专门聚焦设计的业务团队。
人才库的情况如何？是如何演变的？
丹尼尔·韦特：随着人们不再执着于科班出身背景，出现了越来越多非传统教育背景的人才。我们看到新的教育机构、训练营和奖学金层出不穷，而人们接受教育的途径比以前更为丰富。直至今日，四年制本科学位的吸引力已经大不如前，市面上涌现了大量新的学习方式和迈入高技能职位的途径。这是人才库发生的一大巨变。
朱迪·韦特：我想补充的是，如今还逐渐出现了导师群体。人们意识到需要为下一代规划未来，而处于行业顶尖位置的人士则在想办法回馈社会。这是一个为未来着想的良好转变，我认为教育必须成为其中的一部分。如何引导商科类学生与设计师联手？如何促进设计师与政府机构的合作？技术专家又如何与商人合作？这些问题比只是学习商业或设计更为复杂，而现在正是需要专业导师提供引导的时候。
教育系统应如何参与其中？
丹尼尔·韦特：我们必须保证设计的发展方式和工程类一样。有人可能把设计等同于艺术，甚至在家长-教师层面也是如此。然而，设计和艺术是截然不同的。设计之于企业，如同MBA或软件工程师一样关键。设计给世界带来了价值，如果我们想扩充设计师人才库，就需要影响更多下一代学习设计。
朱迪·韦特：尽管许多客户都看重工艺和美学，但我认为两者只占设计的一小部分。企业希望员工可以具备战略思考，又能够做出令人愉悦的漂亮设计。通过常规教育，人们可以获得一部分技能。我们推荐过一位有计算机背景的高级副总裁，但他负责的产品设计却是学科之外的领域。现在的工作跨越了业务、设计和技术，而教育机构必须把这些要求结合起来。
客户最需要具备哪些技能的人才？
丹尼尔·韦特：多才多艺的T型人才。客户需要精通某一项技能，但在其他方面同样很优秀的人才。对风险环境感到兴奋的人会发现更多机遇。早期的创业公司提供了很多机会，但一定会有风险。
朱迪·韦特：我认为处于快速变化的企业中，这种品质同样是首位的。如果想在初创企业或《财富》美国500强企业闯出一片天地，没有一定的韧性和风险承担能力，就可能被淘汰。行业正在快速发展，你需要掌握特定领域的知识，也需要保持专业度和符合个人成长目标的品质，努力适应令人不舒适的工作，将其变成加分项。
C级高管需要具备哪些特质？
朱迪·韦特：对于设计师和设计行业领导者来说，沟通和叙事很重要。讲好故事容易打动合作伙伴和利益相关者，而具备高超的沟通技巧，便能够应对艰难的对话。设计师若想获得高管青睐，需要掌握沟通的艺术。这并非只是建立一种策略，也关乎在快速壮大的企业里如何塑造和加以推行。设计行业发展迅速，而企业的发展也如此之快，对于想要成功的人来说，信念至关重要。
目前，《财富》美国500强企业在设计领域面临的最大挑战是什么？
丹尼尔·韦特：没有足够的设计师来满足当下的需求。目前的供需并不平衡，这对那些十分看重设计的《财富》美国500强公司来说将是巨大的挑战。它们以前需要雇佣两位设计师，但现在需要六位。教育机构应该为未来做好准备。
Wert & Co.的下一步计划是什么？
朱迪·韦特：我们正在观察应如何让设计融入企业——让企业家、发明家和科学家协同合作——我们也想确保自己能够关顾到下一代的发展。我们要在公司和人才之间拓展更广泛的人力资源，而以何种方式实现，还请拭目以待。我们对前景和自身策略感觉不错，但同时也尽量静观其变，避免仓促行事。对于未来，我们倍感激动。（财富中文网）
译者：Emily
在招募设计团队方面，Wert & Co.有一套行之有效的方法论。自1995年成立以来，该公司为《财富》美国500强公司、全球各大品牌和新创企业招募了不少颇有分量的设计类关键带头人。朱迪·韦特是一名设计师，她和丈夫杰夫在儿子丹尼尔上幼儿园的第一天，在自家客厅创办了业务遍布东西海岸的猎头公司。作为协助大公司寻觅设计、技术和创新类人才不可或缺的可靠合作伙伴，随着客户群不断增长，公司声誉也越来越好。现在，她的儿子丹尼尔已经为公司迈入下一阶段做好了准备：凭借为早期创业公司做人力资源工作的背景，他加入公司并担任总经理一职；除了负责工程、设计和产品类职位的招聘工作，还雄心勃勃地参与到设计行业领导人才的发展中。在此，这对母子档谈到了公司早期的发展历程、设计业的前景以及C级高管到底需要什么样的特质。
《财富》：Wert & Co.是怎样创建的？
朱迪·韦特：当时数字领域才刚刚兴起，设计和科技行业都在寻找发展方向。我们先是租了一张办公桌，接着几个月后租了间办公室开始创业。再过了几个月，我们雇了员工，而客户也在持续增长。那是一个很好的时机，适合挖掘希望在设计和科技助力商业的新浪潮中乘风破浪的人才。我们的品牌理念是：“在这里，让跨领域学科找准定位，让设计助推商业成功。”这是我们在1995年做出的承诺，但行业发展到今天也依然适用。
随着时代变迁，设计行业发生了哪些转变？
丹尼尔·韦特：如果从我们公司的发展历程来看，设计业的变化轨迹与爆发新冠疫情以后会有所不同。以旁观者的视角看来，有两点让我颇为震惊。第一，设计受到了重视。在以前，设计被视为辅助的注脚或事后想法。当然，随着技术的崛起，越来越多的公司转型成了科技公司，所以设计的重要性也增加了。对Wert & Co.而言，最初很多客户都属于时尚、平面设计、工业设计和印刷等创意领域。而后，我们开始越来越多地接触软件开发公司。科技占据了我们很多的生活空间，而设计是生活的反映。这是一个很大的转变。如今在领导层、董事会和风险投资中，都能够看到设计的身影。在公司从无到有的阶段，设计变得越来越重要。
爆发疫情后，设计业有哪些变化？疫情有没有改变公司的招聘方式？
丹尼尔·韦特：人才库现在都是全球化的。如今，很多公司更愿意到非典型的地方招募人才，以建立更国际化的网络。如果你开的小公司位于小镇，而一群大公司喊着“我们要去那里搞招聘”，那么这间小公司就会面临前所未有的竞争。在这种情况下，难以从地理角度来推断员工的薪酬，通常大型公司将从中受益。疫情肯定催生了这种转变，但谁也无法预测5至10年后会是什么样......我认为，员工从来没有像今天这样拥有如此大的权力，这将迫使公司改变留住员工的方式，比如提供居家工作的选择和其他福利。在过去一年里，每个人的理想生活都面临危机，就业环境也变得更加复杂。几乎每家公司都把招聘计划搁置了很久，而现在，他们正试图把失去的时间补回来。
你提到各大公司正在追赶招聘进度，如何看待这种情况？
丹尼尔·韦特：我们都听过“雇用要慢，解雇要快”的谚语，也明白其含义是：双重考量，一次解决，如果公司发展不顺利，就需要迅速果断地做出决策。如果公司不够体贴，就会优化在职员工，而不一定要留人。因此，目前可能会出现减员和裁员潮。我希望不要发生这种情况，但如果发生了也不会感到惊讶。
朱迪·韦特：需要在招聘和规划时建立更多规则，以便留住人才和壮大公司文化。
过去一年里，您的公司完成了哪些重要的招聘工作？
朱迪·韦特：我们有幸参与的猎头工作体现了不同的范畴，并更加深刻地凸显出设计在当下的地位。疫情期间，我们为《纽约时报》（New York Times）寻觅到一位产品设计高级副总裁。这是一家受强烈使命感驱动的媒体，而好的新闻工作比以往任何时候都重要。在爆发疫情和种族正义运动期间，《纽约时报》需要寻找人才提升产品设计，这项工作很复杂，也令人兴奋，雇佣环节还涉及多方利益相关者。《纽约时报》在寻求转型，我们的文化和世界也在发生改变。另一大领域则围绕着数据和隐私；实时数据和人工智能正在成为常态。我们需要为一家金融机构的数据伦理和机器学习部门招募一位经验丰富的设计领导者，其工作需要以负责、安全的方式解锁数据。第三项任务则与旅游业有关。我们都知道，该行业受到了疫情的严重冲击。我们为四季酒店（Four Seasons）招募到一位高级设计副总裁。该公司正在思考奢侈品消费者的未来，特别打算在后疫情时代，利用设计思维优化四季酒店的体验和品牌接触点。
为什么招募设计类人才很重要？
朱迪·韦特：对企业而言，设计是一项极具战略性的工具。企业需要精通工艺、内容和技术，并且怀着无限勇气和信念带来改变的设计师。无论是社会创新还是其他新的赛道，现在都有很多创新的机会，而公司内部也正在组建新的专门聚焦设计的业务团队。
人才库的情况如何？是如何演变的？
丹尼尔·韦特：随着人们不再执着于科班出身背景，出现了越来越多非传统教育背景的人才。我们看到新的教育机构、训练营和奖学金层出不穷，而人们接受教育的途径比以前更为丰富。直至今日，四年制本科学位的吸引力已经大不如前，市面上涌现了大量新的学习方式和迈入高技能职位的途径。这是人才库发生的一大巨变。
朱迪·韦特：我想补充的是，如今还逐渐出现了导师群体。人们意识到需要为下一代规划未来，而处于行业顶尖位置的人士则在想办法回馈社会。这是一个为未来着想的良好转变，我认为教育必须成为其中的一部分。如何引导商科类学生与设计师联手？如何促进设计师与政府机构的合作？技术专家又如何与商人合作？这些问题比只是学习商业或设计更为复杂，而现在正是需要专业导师提供引导的时候。
教育系统应如何参与其中？
丹尼尔·韦特：我们必须保证设计的发展方式和工程类一样。有人可能把设计等同于艺术，甚至在家长-教师层面也是如此。然而，设计和艺术是截然不同的。设计之于企业，如同MBA或软件工程师一样关键。设计给世界带来了价值，如果我们想扩充设计师人才库，就需要影响更多下一代学习设计。
朱迪·韦特：尽管许多客户都看重工艺和美学，但我认为两者只占设计的一小部分。企业希望员工可以具备战略思考，又能够做出令人愉悦的漂亮设计。通过常规教育，人们可以获得一部分技能。我们推荐过一位有计算机背景的高级副总裁，但他负责的产品设计却是学科之外的领域。现在的工作跨越了业务、设计和技术，而教育机构必须把这些要求结合起来。
客户最需要具备哪些技能的人才？
丹尼尔·韦特：多才多艺的T型人才。客户需要精通某一项技能，但在其他方面同样很优秀的人才。对风险环境感到兴奋的人会发现更多机遇。早期的创业公司提供了很多机会，但一定会有风险。
朱迪·韦特：我认为处于快速变化的企业中，这种品质同样是首位的。如果想在初创企业或《财富》美国500强企业闯出一片天地，没有一定的韧性和风险承担能力，就可能被淘汰。行业正在快速发展，你需要掌握特定领域的知识，也需要保持专业度和符合个人成长目标的品质，努力适应令人不舒适的工作，将其变成加分项。
C级高管需要具备哪些特质？
朱迪·韦特：对于设计师和设计行业领导者来说，沟通和叙事很重要。讲好故事容易打动合作伙伴和利益相关者，而具备高超的沟通技巧，便能够应对艰难的对话。设计师若想获得高管青睐，需要掌握沟通的艺术。这并非只是建立一种策略，也关乎在快速壮大的企业里如何塑造和加以推行。设计行业发展迅速，而企业的发展也如此之快，对于想要成功的人来说，信念至关重要。
目前，《财富》美国500强企业在设计领域面临的最大挑战是什么？
丹尼尔·韦特：没有足够的设计师来满足当下的需求。目前的供需并不平衡，这对那些十分看重设计的《财富》美国500强公司来说将是巨大的挑战。它们以前需要雇佣两位设计师，但现在需要六位。教育机构应该为未来做好准备。
Wert & Co.的下一步计划是什么？
朱迪·韦特：我们正在观察应如何让设计融入企业——让企业家、发明家和科学家协同合作——我们也想确保自己能够关顾到下一代的发展。我们要在公司和人才之间拓展更广泛的人力资源，而以何种方式实现，还请拭目以待。我们对前景和自身策略感觉不错，但同时也尽量静观其变，避免仓促行事。对于未来，我们倍感激动。（财富中文网）
译者：Emily
When it comes to hiring design teams, Wert & Co. has a proven formula. The agency has collectively brokered a significant share of key design leadership roles at Fortune 500 companies, global brands, and innovative start-ups since 1995. Judy Wert, a designer by trade, started the bi-coastal executive search firm with her husband Jeff in their living room on the first day their son Daniel went to kindergarten. As her clientele grew, so did her reputation as a trusted and integral partner to major corporations in hiring for design, technology, and innovation. Now, ready for the company’s next phase, Daniel has joined as managing director, bringing with him a background in human resources for early start-ups; recruiting for engineering, design and product; and an ambition to participate in the next phase of growth for design leadership. Here, the mother-son team discuss the firm’s early years, where the design space is headed and what c-suite leadership are looking for.
Fortune: How did you start Wert & Co.?
JW: The digital explosion had just started; design and technology were finding their way together. We rented a desk, and a few months later we rented an office. A few months after that, we hired some people. Our clients continued to grow. It was a wonderful time to tap into talent who were looking to ride the next wave of what design and technology were going to do for business. We had a tagline, “Where converging disciplines find their place. Where design is integral to business success.” Those were our commitments back in 1995 and they remain true today, though that story is expanding.
How have you seen the industry shift over time?
DW: If we are looking at the arc over our history, the answer is different than the arc since COVID. From my perspective, watching from the sidelines, two things have stuck out for me. First, design is seen as important. Earlier, it was seen as a footnote, or an afterthought. Then, of course, there’s a technology component, as more and more companies become tech companies, so to speak. For Wert & Co., a lot of our work was initially in fashion, graphic design, industrial design, and print; anywhere creativity lived. More and more, you’re starting to see hardware with a software component. Technology has taken over a lot of our lives and the design industry is a reflection of our lives. That is a big shift. Now we’re seeing design at the leadership level and in boardrooms, in venture capital. Design is having its moment at the zero to one stage of a company.
And the arc since COVID? Has the pandemic changed the way companies are hiring?
DW: The talent pool is inherently global now. Companies are now more open to recruiting in atypical places, creating a more international web. If you’re a small company in a small town, and a bunch of large companies say, “We’re going to recruit there,” that small company now has competition it never had before. Compensation in that scenario is more geographically agnostic. The larger companies will benefit from this. That’s for sure a shift accelerated by COVID, but who knows what that looks like five to 10 years from now…I don’t think the employee ever has had as much power as it has today. That will force companies to change the way they retain people with the option to work from home and the benefits they offer. That’s been compounded by everyone in the last year having a crisis on what they want in life. In addition, almost every company has put hiring on hold for too long and they are trying to make up for lost time.
You mention companies playing catch up with hiring. How do you see that playing out?
DW: We have all heard the adage, “Hire slowly, fire quickly.” I think we all know what it means: Measure twice, cut once, and if things don’t work out, be decisive and swift. If companies aren’t thoughtful, they are optimizing for butts in seats and not necessarily for retention. There could be a recoil down the line in the form of attrition and layoffs. I hope that doesn’t happen, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it did.
JW: There needs to be more discipline built into hiring, recruiting and planning, to allow for retention and thriving culture.
What are some examples of roles you've filled in the last year?
JW: I do think the searches we’ve been privileged to work on show a range and speak to where design is in the conversation now in a deeper way. We completed a search for the New York Times during COVID for their SVP of Product Design. We know good journalism matters now more than ever, and this is an incredibly mission-driven ambitious company. The Times was looking for someone to elevate product design, amid COVID, amid racial justice movement. That was complex and exciting, and there were multiple stakeholders involved to sign off on the hire. It was a moment in time for the NYT, during a moment in time in our culture and our world. Another big area is around data and privacy; real time data and AI are becoming the norm. We were tasked with hiring an experienced design leadership role for data ethics and machine learning at a financial institution. The goal was to unlock data, but in a responsible and secure way. A third was related to travel, which we all know was heavily impacted by COVID. We hired an SVP of Design for the Four Seasons. The company is thinking about the future of the luxury consumer, especially post COVID, and using design thinking at every touch point of the Four Seasons brand experience.
Why is hiring in the design space important?
JW: Design is such a strategic tool for these businesses. They need designers who have craft and content fluency, technological fluency, and unfettered courage and conviction to make a difference in the world. There is so much opportunity for innovation, be it social innovation or new avenues where people inside companies are building new business groups focused on how design can play a role.
What is the talent pool like and how is it evolving?
DW: There are more nontraditional educational backgrounds as the trend moves away from formal degrees. We’re seeing the emergence of new educational institutions, boot camps, and fellowships. There are more and more ways for people to be trained up than ever before. The allure of a four-year degree has been eroded over time and there are a ton of new ways to learn and get into high skilled positions. That has been a huge shift in the talent pool.
JW: I’d add that the mentorship community has stepped up. People are realizing we need to plan for the next generation. There are people who are at the top of their game and are trying to figure out how they give back. That’s a big, wonderful shift to think about for the future, and I think education has to be part of that conversation. How are we educating a business student to work with a designer? A designer to work with a government agency? A technologist to work with a business person? It's more complex than just to go and study business or design. This is the time mentoring needs to happen more prolifically.
How can the education system participate?
DW: We have to make sure design grows in the same way engineering has. Even at the parent-teacher level, where some may equate design with art. Design and art are not the same things. Design can be as critical to a business as an MBA or a software engineer. If we're going to increase the talent pool of designers, more kids will be influenced to go into design because of the value it brings to the world.
JW: I think craft and aesthetics is one small piece of design, but it is still an ask by many of our clients. They want their hires to think through strategy, and make it delightful and beautiful. Some of that is learned through a disciplined education. We placed an SVP who was trained as a computer scientist. He is now in charge of product design, but it was really about what he exposed himself too outside of that. It is about being fluent in the business, the design, and the technology. Educational institutions are going to have to marry those requirements.
What are the most sought-after skill sets for your clients?
DW: T-shape versatility. Clients want someone who is great at one thing and pretty good at everything else. And then, if you can market yourself as someone who finds risk exciting, you’ll find so many more opportunities. There are a lot of opportunities at earlier stage startups and there is an inherent level of risk there.
JW: I think that same quality is paramount in a business that is in rapid pace of change. If you want to make a difference whether it’s a startup or a Fortune 500, if you aren’t wired with resilience and some risk you might be left behind. It’s fast moving. You need to have mastery of domain knowledge, and other qualities that are going to keep you on track toward professional and personal growth and purpose. You need to be comfortable with what’s uncomfortable.
What about C-Suite leadership?
JW: It is important for designers and design leaders to communicate a narrative. Storytelling is something people need to influence partners and stakeholders and be inside the hard conversations, with mastery. For designers to have executive access, they need to be able to communicate the narrative. It isn’t about just creating a strategy. How do you then shape it and push it through an organization that’s working at speed and scale? The industry is moving so fast. Businesses are growing so quickly. Conviction is paramount for anyone who wants to succeed.
What is the biggest challenge facing Fortune 500 companies in the design space at the moment?
DW: There aren't enough designers to meet today's demand. The needs and demands are incongruent, at the moment. That will be huge for the Fortune 500 companies that are now seeing design as important. They once needed to hire two designers, but now they need six. Educational institutions need to prepare for the future.
What is next for Wert & Co.?
JW: We are watching and observing in terms of how design is integrated in organizations— the entrepreneurs and inventors and scientists— and we want to make sure we are taking care for the next generation. We need to be a wider human resource for companies and talent alike. What format that takes, stay tuned. We have a good feel for what it’s going to look like and how we’ll speak about it. But we are trying to make sure we don’t rush that process and speak before it finishes. We're excited for the next chapter.
