Thomas D. Gorman: And that was the subject of your presentation, which was a very memorable presentation. 2001 was of course also a very momentous year for China, it was the year that China entered the World Trade Organization, and that was a historic catalyst for all kinds of changes, including in the economics sphere, investment sphere and in terms of integration of China with the world economy.
Looking back to that period of time, we had ten Chinese companies on the Fortune Global 500 list. By contrast in 2009 we had 37. That's incredible growth, obviously, in a very short period of time.
And in that same time span -- 2001 to 2009 -- 50%, actually more than 50% growth in the number of publicly listed Chinese's companies. Whether listed abroad or in the domestic market, so also a lot of change there. Meanwhile, we've just been through the most turbulent period the world economy has seen in living memory.
Jim Collins: Yeah.
Thomas D. Gorman: So all of these things strike me as giving us a very opportune moment in which to consider the principles of greatness that you have written about, so eloquently, how they may apply to this phenomenal growth of the Chinese corporate universe, and also, in the context of the current turbulence that we're living through, which I know is the subject of the book you're working on now.
Jim Collins: It's sort of about the permanent turbulence I think we'll be in.
Thomas D. Gorman: Right. So I thought this would be a great place to revisit some of these subjects and I can't think of a better place to start, than the first sentence of "Good to Great" which is of course, "Good is the enemy of great" and I'd be interested in your thoughts about the universality of that. Do you think that applies as much to companies in China or any other country as it does to the (U.S. company) research set that lead you to that observation?
Jim Collins: Well, we were speaking a moment ago about the rise of the business group in China today, and how there are business leaders who want to build a great company.
And there's a big difference between having a good company that is successful or just being a successful person, or just making a lot of money, and building a great institution, a great company, something that in my mind, a really great company is all about, in the end is a company that delivers such exceptional results. And makes such a distinctive impact on the world it touches. Whether it's a small world or a big world, that if you took it away, it would leave an unfillable hole that couldn't be filled by any other institution. That you've built something that is truly distinctively special and exceptional in how well it performs.
And that you can't do by simply saying, good enough is, you have to say, no, in order to really be indispensable, to truly reach that point, where something would be lost if we went away.
That requires a dedication to building something far more than just successful, which is: a great company. |
|
高德思：那也是你发言的主题，让人难以忘怀。当然2001年对中国来说，也是非常值得纪念的一年。中国加入了世贸组织，这对各种变革来说都是历史性的催化剂，作用于经济、投资以及中国与世界经济大环境融合等各个方面。
回首那一时期，有10家中国企业名列《财富》世界500强排行榜。形成鲜明对比的是，到2009年，这个榜单上有了37家中国企业。在如此短的时间内，实现这样的增长让人感到难以置信。
在相同的时间跨度里，从2001年到2009年，中国的上市公司数量增加了50%还要多，包括在国外和国内上市的，同样产生了巨大的变化。与此同时，我们经历了当代人记忆中世界经济最为混乱的时期。
吉姆·柯林斯：是的。
高德思：这些变化都深深地触动了我们，让我们利用这个适宜的契机，去思考你写到的“卓越”的基本原则，思考如何将这些原则应用到中国快速成长的商业环境中，或是用这些原则来解释当前动荡的大环境，而我知道，这也是你手头正在创作的那本书的主题。
吉姆·柯林斯：在我看来这种经济动荡会一直持续下去。
高德思：对。所以我想，现在我们可以重温其中的一些主题。我能想到的最好的开场白，莫过于《从优秀到卓越》书中的第一句话：“优秀是卓越的敌人。”我很想知道，你是否认为这句话是放之四海而皆准的。通过观察一组美国公司，你得出了这些结论。你是否认为这一原则也适用于中国或其他任何国家的企业？
吉姆·柯林斯：我们刚刚谈到了当今中国商业集团的崛起，谈到许多商业领袖想要建立卓越的企业。
做一家成功的公司、做一个成功的人、或挣一大笔钱，与建立一家卓越的机构、一家卓越的企业之间存在着很大的区别。在我看来，一家真正卓越的企业，归根结底就是能够产生优异的业绩，并且对其所接触的领域会产生巨大的影响。无论这个领域是小是大，一旦这家企业不在了，它将留下一个无法填补的空洞，其他任何机构都无法填补。因为这家企业的表现超凡脱俗，它建立起了真正与众不同的、特殊的价值。
为了实现“卓越”，你不能说“我们已经够好了”。你必须得说“还不够”，如此才能让你的企业变得不可或缺，才能在你们离开时，让大家觉得缺少了什么。
这需要企业家身全心投入进去，建立一家远远超越“成功”这个层次的企业，也就是我们所说的卓越的企业。 |
